Ep16: From Taboo to Trust: Bold Care, Bold Talk ft. Rajat Jadhav

Sexless lifestyle is a very big reason for divorces in India. >> But they are like anything that gets me better, let's just try it out. >> Somebody's not going to talk to their friend that okay, they're facing maybe an ED issue or a P issue, but in their head it starts eating them up, right? >> India is a tough tough market, especially talking about sexual wellness. Men's sexual wellness is even more tabooed because merco >> because what do you think is the average age of somebody who's facing let's say EDP in India? If you had to guess, what

do you think you would go for? >> Tiger bones. with powder which works right or red bull having uh bulls balls stuff right stuff like that right is India ready to have these kind of conversations you would never expect a guy who's maybe making 20 odd a month to get scammed out of 40 odd,000 rupees just because somebody told him this is this magic remedy that's going to solve unfortunately not the most educated gentleman but it is very important like intercourse is very important you know especially for young men right and you if they start facing those false

treatment it dents their ego do quite a lot >> is about jinzies >> because for them self love is not at the top of the pyramid. Self- loveve is as basel as Roti Kapra and Macan. >> But can we build the best sexual health and wellness company in India and in a legitimate manner which is not trying to do the same thing that has happened to the ecosystem for the longest time. >> Which bold product would you recommend for someone who's going on their first date? [Music]

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business bottom line, all in a secure and a single environment. This episode is brought to you by Super Checkout, the world's first AI powered checkout that lets you split, combine, or co-ay with friends and family in real time. Whether it's shopping, gifting, or travel bookings, now everyone can chip in with ease. Check out smarter with super checkout. Hello everyone. Welcome to yet another amazing episode of the Innovators and Disruptors podcast. I'm your host Abh Tandan and I'm here in Mumbai to shoot this next conversation that I have with

someone who's been the brain behind dstigmatizing sexual wellness in this country. As we all know, sexual wellness has always been considered as a taboo. Probably still is to a certain degree in a lot of places in the country. But he's the one who decided to fight against that barrier, against that mental barrier. The mindset which talks about this as a taboo. Men's sexual wellness is super critical. Most people, most men are apprehensive about talking about it and he tried to disrupt the whole industry. In fact, they've become really big very

very soon because of all the hard work they have put in. And to talk more about this, I have an amazing guest Raja Jada who is the co-founder of Boldare. Thank you so much Raja for being here. >> Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. >> Pleasure. Pleasure is all ours. You know we as consumers are going to be listening to a lot of your perspectives. It's you know I do want to talk to you about a lot of different things today but I'll start with the elephant in the room. India is a tough tough market specifically talking about sexual

wellness. >> Sure >> men's sexual wellness is even more tabooed because so people perceive that you know they cannot talk about sexual aspects about a men's a men's situation that they go through and you have tackled that head head on right. What gave you those bold I mean what what was the bold move that you had to make to get into bold care or build bold care? How did you gather guts to do something like this? >> Um you know I think first of all we were very naive. I was 23 when I started

this. So I think we were lot we were a lot focused on the problem statement itself. M >> I don't think me or my co-founders were you know spending a lot of time thinking about okay what's you know what's the society going to say or is it a taboo topic to speak about uh that was not the case you know what ended up happening in our case was before doing this I had started another company and when I was doing that uh it was basically an e-arm pharmacy business what I realized was almost 40% of the customers that were coming to us they were coming with

sexual problem statements >> so that is when you know the sort of light bulb went in our head okay very interesting right for an app that looks pretty [ __ ] you know the first hour we 19 year old kids didn't know anything about how to do anything you know in terms of building a company and we just put like MVP life uh for some reason in this one category a lot of interest was coming our way right so we that sort of stayed with us uh eventually that business didn't pan out and you know went to the other side of the table spent three and a half years on the uh

you know couple of funds >> that's when I started realizing for other healthcare companies also the same thing keeps on happening you know where one of the biggest problem statements that men reach out to them for is basically a sexual health problem statement so it's very true that >> somebody's is not going to talk to their friend that okay they're facing maybe an ED issue or a P issue but in their head it starts eating them up right and it becomes something that goes right to the top of their mind you know thing that I try to tell people is with men if

they're having hair loss issues they generally tend to rationalize it in about 6 8 months because they see other bald people around and they're like okay you know it's natural part of life it's you know something that happens to a lot of men it's fine you know I'll deal with it but when like a 29 30 31 year old guy starts facing ED as a problem erectile dysfunction as a problem statement premature ejaculation as a problem statement it starts eating them up right so then >> for them while there's no avenue to go and speak to folks internet does become

a source for them to go and start searching for avenues to solve it >> and what we realize okay there's a lot of intent from people it's a very high intent sort of a space where they want to explore and find a solution but maybe there's no easy way for them to go into a funnel where by the end of that funnel the complete solution is provided to them right so we realize okay there's an interesting opportunity it's a very very large problem statement you know there going to be about 90 odd million men in the country who at some point in their life are going to face ED or P. 90

million is a crazy stat. It's about two and a half times the number of men facing diabetes. So that gives you that relative gauge of how big >> the problem statement is >> for such a big sort of >> uh let's say issue that let's say a large population is facing. If id asked you by what's a good men's sexual brand >> hopefully you say bold hair now but you know when we were starting out we did this quite often right we would keep on going and asking okay tell me a good sexual brand and nobody would really have an answer right so we realized okay

there's a very clear supply demand mismatch here as well >> right >> so answering your question I don't think the taboo is where we got stuck we were just so damn naive and so young that we were like okay you know this looks like something very interesting we have some firsthand experience from our previous company we have some experience that we have sort of gathered by being in the ecosystem for a it >> and maybe we are the right team to go and build for it. Right? So we just you know

>> put our head down, started building and yeah somehow we are here. >> No fantastic. In fact >> in a lot of movies they show this right and movies have also been responsible for some of the taboo creation. I mean I'm I'm assuming that they try to break the taboo >> but you see those tents. >> Yeah. >> Right. Roadside tents >> where there's this old man sitting inside >> omni car on the side of the road. That's like the cliche.

>> Exactly. Right. and you go inside and you know you're very skeptical you're looking here and there you know and then I go inside and ask for any dai or jibouti or whatever right to treat some of the sexual issues that they you know they're having or going through and uh but I think Rajat when we were speaking there there was a very interesting conversation that had come up a few days back uh you know when you're starting out there were a lot of very fundamental challenges majority of the marketplaces >> of fintech platform forms, payment

gateways etc were very reluctant in partnering with bold care because of the perception that they had pertaining to Indian sexual wellness company >> right and I'm sure that there would have been a hard battle that you must have fought to solve for those can you give us a little bit of a perspective about what was what was starting of this company like >> yeah you know um so when we started the space was almost non-existent from an online India perspective in a lot of ways Right? While on aggregator platforms where

you're not just going to find one problem statement, you're going to find sort of a plethora of problem statement. Sure, you would find a subcategory for let's say psychologist on maybe the aggregators um you know the e-arm pharmacy players whatnot. But there weren't any standalone companies that were sort of taking the whole uh sort of funnel and trying to say okay I'll take care of the whole journey right right from maybe giving free consultations to let's say a very holistic set of products right so we were one of the first ones of our kind that entered into

the space and what we realized as soon as we started is >> the perception around a company like this is that it's most likely going to be a scam you know it's most likely going to be selling me some you know uh Japani oil some unani solution which is not going to be effective but you're going to price it for like45 5,000 bucks make that money on the first order and then you know uh you know run away right fly by night operators right so that was the whole perception so when we started what I and we started right in the middle of covid I think the company

launched on 14th March and if I remember it's like 20th or 22nd I think the first wave started so it was already a weird sort of a time because nobody knew in that first wave what's really going to happen and we thought okay that is maybe the big challenge uh thankfully fundraising wasn't because I just sort of paid my dues to the other side of the table so I had a small tiny bit of network created. So that was somewhat of a problem that had solved. What really happened was we started realizing okay we can't even go live because and again these are phenomenal platforms and I get

it from their perspective as well but you know payment gateways are not ready to work with us. Uh the shipping partners were not ready to work with us. Most of the marketplaces were not ready to work. Most of the marketplace didn't really have a category. The the general marketplaces didn't really have a category called sexual health at that point. Right? So the perception for them was okay this is most likely a scam company and doesn't make sense for us to take the risk on any which ways the category is damn small you know so that's a question I've had to deal with

a lot in the first two three years that oh it's a small category any which ways >> so because nobody had ever seen a success story in the space right so >> the first maybe 3 months for the first 3 months you know we were doing just pure cash on delivery because there was just no payment gateway uh it took us that long to just even crack the first one thankfully I had a little bit of a background where I could call some folks up to call their, you know, friends out. Kibai, >> this guy's not going to run away tomorrow. He's trying to build something

very, very legit. They they have put a lot of sort of thought behind it. They're working with the right people. >> Maybe you give them, you know, you at least speak to the guy, right? And maybe in the first two and a half, three months, I've pitched more to these platforms than to investors. Uh I remember pitching to all I remember creating decks for all of these guys. Guys, this is how big the space is. There is nobody. I'm trying to like legitimately solve it. Just give me a payment gateway. I'm not even asking for much more. Right? So yeah it was a

challenging space you know it seems very grand to see that you have created a category um and in some cases folks have done it like the Uber guys you know all of those guys have really truly fundamentally created like big big opportunities I don't think we've done anything like that >> but in a little small manner I think we have contributed to the space right because now if you see the category it's extremely mainstream now if you see any of the large platforms is going to be one of the fastest growing any of the quickcom platforms is going to be one of

the fastest growing subcategories for them right um payment gateway is no longer a challenge shipping is not a challenge. We work with you know some of the best investors are there with us. We work with some of these I mean one of the partners is in one of the shipping companies an investor in the company now. So you know that is where how the journey has sort of transitioned over the last maybe five years but it's true you know you had to sort of break through that you know go and >> once you put a face to who's building they get a little bit of comfort okay

you know this guy is a legit guy uh he's truly trying to it works out or not is a different question but at least it's not going to be something that's a scam right >> so yeah it was a very challenging I mean the first three months were like a weird journey where I'm like okay why are these guys saying no to me like I I was so naive that many I didn't even clock it in my these guys have like this big issue with the category you know slightly over time I started actually realizing it from their perspective how they are thinking about

it but for me like okay just like you know it's but obvious try to solve it >> right >> so yeah maybe the first three months were challenging I mean the first couple of years were challenging it's a damn hard space to be in right >> um but yeah somehow the categories created you know uh things are panning out quite well yeah >> quick couple of follow-ups right one is Did I mean how are the government regulations around this FDA approvals and stuff like that? Did that also seem

to be a challenge or was that easy and would once you must have gotten some of these approvals and licenses etc. did that also help you to crack these marketplaces and uh you know plat uh other platforms as well? I mean I >> payment gateways >> so they're slightly exclusive you know where I don't think that specifically got us to um you know get onto these platforms because you know end of the day you will you will still find Japani solutions there you will still find unani solutions there right so um I don't think that did the sort of trick

for them it was more I think they just developed comfort with the company because we were live for the first 3 months without you know any of these services we were just doing cash on delivery >> so then we started then they realized okay this is actually quite a legit operation like the products I have you know the way they're doing it is it's quite quite legit right so um I mean we have a lot of we have a certain way of doing things right we don't want to sexualize the problem statement we don't want to be uh you know in your face you

know uh uh guy under the blanket that that's not the way we want to build we want to keep it >> we want to treat it for what it is it's a healthcare issue and we'll treat it as what it is right and I think that sort of started going you know folks started uh understanding that and then you know then onward was they first the first guy takes you on then the other guy see okay they have taken them on then two more come in. So you know the ball sort of starts rolling right. So that was slightly exclusive then maybe the um the the regulations that see for there is a

certain set of regulations that we have to we are you know uh we have products that go right from let's say alopathy to natural so be it you know FDA MHFDA or let's say um FSACI we do have to have the licenses to even you know uh have these products in our portfolio. So that is something that we took care of even before we had started the company. Um thankfully I have that e-arm pharmacy experience so I wouldn't want to make it too much bigger than what it is but then I had a little bit of experience of understanding okay what what is required what the minus1 to zero in this category

is you know how do you even come to a place where you're ready to launch now so then you know from I think we launched in so we launched in July 2020 but we started working on this in October of 2019 so from that October until January uh we got a lot of these things you know the licenses um the correct approvals we got a lot of that sorted out. Um, a lot of the manufacturing was happening at that period as well. Um, so they were exclusive. We have never really had challenges, you know. Uh, and this is not something I'm saying just to be

safe. I've really not had challenges, you know. I think, um, I have been handed a pretty good deck of cards in terms of the environment. Sure, there were challenges and I'm fairly optimistic as so I'll always answer maybe in this manner. But then uh, from let's say larger challenges which were not solvable, I don't think we faced those, right? We were always facing challenges that were solvable. Um they were more sort of human challenges of people just not trusting the category rather than some compliance problem statement that I was stuck on or some

regulatory problem statement I was stuck on. Yeah. >> Got it. Uh amazing perspective Rajat. In fact, I was thinking that there's there's a there's a lot of uh whereaboutry or hairsay in this ecosystem. Like for example, someone would talk about tiger bones which powder >> which works right or red bull having uh bulls balls stuff right and stuff like that right people talk about it. It's all here. What about you around that right? Uh do you think in a market such as this is India ready to have these

kind of conversations? >> Yeah. Um okay so what do you think is the average age of somebody who's facing let's say EDP in India if you had to guess what do you think you would go for >> 40 >> yeah so exactly right you will go for 40 I think the >> global average is going to be about 35 >> and the Indian average is actually going to be about 2930 >> wow >> it's an extremely young individual who's starting to face these problem

statements on average you can imagine a 30-year-old or a 29 year old guy you know they have >> or they're born in like 92 93 you know what not They've I mean 96 if they've 29 uh >> and they have you know properly grown up with the internet. I mean for the last 10 odd years 12 odd years they have they've you know they've been online they've been sort of they've had you know the burst of information coming their way from all sources. Right. >> Right. >> So for a modern 30-year-old guy 29 year

old guy I don't think they trust the solutions that somebody could have trusted maybe two or three decades back. M >> I think for them they are looking for legitimate solutions but they're not able to find it and that is where boldare comes in because we are the legitimate source for them to come and find a solution that truly works for them right >> so I do think the market is really developed you know now this is the time for somebody to come and build it it's obviously the majority is still

disorganized and it's slowly moving towards organized maybe this is one of those last spaces of consumer healthcare where the organization is starting to happen now you know in some other categories maybe it happened in two decades back three decades back but here it's starting to happen now uh But yeah, the timing is very very good because I think for the modern man, they can't, you know, they can't be trusting. I think they've had enough information come their way where they know just intuitively what is a legitimate solution and what is not, right? What is

just going to be a magic remedy and what's truly, you know, there's data backing it that this fundamentally works, right? Uh that is number one. And also, I think the dynamics are changing quite a lot. You know, I've seen where, you know, for 50 I mean, again, obviously I'm generalizing here, but like for a 50-y old guy, you know, you can sort of you can imagine an average case where the guy can just go to his partner and say, "It's a you know, it's a sexless lifestyle. We'll have to deal with it." But if somebody at 29 or 30 starting to face these problem

statements, they are in a very equal relationship, right? They can't just be like, "Okay, it's a sexless lifestyle deal." They in their own heads know that I fundamentally have to solve this problem statement. So when somebody is that you know I mean you know the master hierarchy is kapani intercourse like it's that fundamental to a man they know it becomes such a big problem in their head that they know okay this is most likely a solution that is going to work and this looks like something that is just quote unquote a magic remedy that's not going to do the trick for me right

true >> so I think the space is changing I think the information around the space I think the general uh >> sort of zit guy is still changing where I think this is the time for somebody to come and build something like this uh I think we started right exactly the time it had to be done because we obviously rode the wave of India you know started to do commerce a lot more online post let's say co um but yeah I do think the market is ready for something like bulkan now and we wouldn't have caught the scale we have got if you know we

were maybe 10 years back or maybe even seven eight years back right so yeah >> that makes a lot of sense right uh in fact that brings me to a very interesting perspective right you say that you know consumers need to be educated right they're open to education but they still need to be educated right and when you're talking about educating consumers, you talk about their problems. Do you how do you reconcile customer education or consumer education with the fact that there could be perception around profiting from shame?

>> Because a lot of people would also believe that these kind of campaigns where you're educating consumers are shaming people who have those issues. Now we don't think of it that way but a lot of the country tier 2s tier 3es might feel awkward about it and they might have this perception your company to they are basically profiting from shame which is not the case but how do you how do you reconcile these things together >> um you know just a line of thought that we just don't have you know I think for me

>> it is a healthcare problem statement somebody has to come and solve it I don't think there is an element of shame here I think shame is something where you are maybe not facing the problem statement and then we are outside in thinking about the issue that is when you would be able to sort of frame it in that manner right but when some guy is actually there in that position he's facing these problem statements you know I've >> when we just started for the first two months I was doing all customer I mean me and my co-founders were doing all

customer support calls right and uh sounds very cool but yeah it's not right you're like on calls back to back right >> uh there was this guy who was maybe like 26 27 uh had a pretty good sexual lifestyle you and had just finished his MBA had broken up with his girlfriend and then spent maybe like 3 4 years on the other side like on the corporate side of things and he was maybe not 26 maybe he was 28 I don't remember but he was he's you know there and there right 28 29 and he started facing sexual health problem statements and he had to break up with his girlfriend so he just

gotten into a new relationship realized he's having these issues and he had to just you know he couldn't deal with telling her that okay I need maybe 3 months to figure this out or a month to figure it out or I need 6 months or I don't know what's happening he couldn't be vulnerable in situation right and he just ended up breaking up in that relationship and the reason he started telling me all this is because we ended up solving the problem and then he got very friendly with us and he was a very early customer right so I wanted to understand a little bit more about how

he's thinking about it as well and he was gracious enough to you know share a lot of his personal experiences but you can sort of put yourself in that guy's position he is what you would see on average and you would think oh this is a very successful fellow right I am spent 3 years on the corporate side of the table must be doing great in his life good-look fellow >> and then you would think about it that this guy is struggling so damn hard in his head that he's not able to be in a relationship with a girl that he's liking just because he knows that he'll

never be able to tell her that okay I'm facing these problem statements. So shame is out of the window thinking about shame in this equation. My worry is I solve this problem and that guy's worry is I myself solve this problem using some let's say ecosystem that has been created right. >> Yeah. So I think just a line of thought that we have I mean just never hired you know I don't think yeah if I was just absolutely you know battering and just sort of out there to make money you know selling whatever

>> the hell I could then maybe the shame question comes but the fact that we have just never done that you know it's just not the ethos of the company >> uh we wouldn't have survived for how long we have survived and sort of thrived to where we have thrived we have come to if that was the early you know uh mindset or the culture of the business, right? The culture of the brand is to be authentic and yeah I just never had these sort of thoughts coming uh coming to us right I think we were very focused critical problem statement uh

>> it is very important like intercourse is very important you know especially for young men right and you if they start facing those problem statements it dents their ego quite a lot and you have to go and then figure out a way to solve it right so you know yeah I always treat it as a healthcare issue I don't think it's anything more than that it is a simple healthcare problem statement just like there are the healthare problems that a guy could So I I I think uh this in a second order thinking if you think about this right not having intercourse would lead to

intimacy issues >> intimacy issues would lead to higher divorces >> higher dissatisfaction higher unhappiness which would also lead to economic impact at the GDP level >> right I'm thinking >> you can extrapolate to anything but yes >> I mean uh so it is fundamentally a very critical need as you also said in >> lifestyle is a very big reason for divorces in India. You know, I think there was it's been a while but there was a study I don't remember if it's like a top three or a top five reason

but then it is there you know right at the top of let's say uh reasons for divorces young divorces you know happening happening in the country. So yeah >> and we've seen that in Japan right the declining population in Japan has been a very primary case study around sexless population and the primary reason could be stress it could be so many other things it could eventually lead into sexual health issues as well >> but uh that's been the case right and that definitely has impacted the economy >> right so very interesting in one of your

conversations or interviews etc you mentioned this in the past that uh you know 90% of the customers that you spoke with had an initial uh apprehension if I can take the liberty of saying so they had an initial apprehension of talking about their problem statements clearly >> right eventually they may have done that when they realized that there was a trust that was building when some of the problems were getting solved like you mentioned of one of the stories can you talk about one unexpected story that you probably wouldn't have thought of of that that you know you came across in

some of these conversations >> uh you know most of it was unexpected to me before because you you generally don't find yourself in situations where uh you know you're having a conversation about sexual health with another man that you know another let's say stranger right I understand like a very very close friend >> but you know if I'm thinking the first thing that really just popped into my head was you know very early on like super early on you know when you were starting out >> uh so this is not actually a

conversation that happened after we had started bold this was just before we were when we were so what we did was you would go to a lot of let's say uh clinics you know uh different sorts of clinics you know some very very legitimate doctors to some where we ourselves knew okay this is you know this is a shady one >> yeah it's a very very shady fellow and I'm pretending to have the issue just to see what Holly says to me and what's the general vibe of the place right you get a lot of sort of intuitions your intuitions get built when you do this

for four five months before starting this for 6 months all three of us you know we were sort of running around all three of us were in different cities so our city right? So I remember having this conversation with somebody in in in Mumbai only actually very close to you know where we are. Yeah. Yeah. Um and this guy used to work in Demart and it's a the legitimate doctor. Yeah. So the the the clinic we were sitting in it's a very legit phenomenal doctor. Uh but yeah this guy used to work at Demart. So I'm assuming he makes like 15 I don't

know back then maybe like 15 18 maybe 20,000 a month right? He got scammed out of 40,000 for a quote unquote magic remedy to a solution to a sort of a unani guy or a shady sort of a fellow that he had gone to before. >> And that tells you a lot, right? You would never expect a guy who's maybe making 20 odd a month to get scammed out of 40 or,000 rupees just because somebody told him this is this magic remedy that's going to solve. Unfortunately, not the most educated gentleman, but you could I could just sort of feel the pain in that guy's, you

know, uh his situation that he got scammed. It was such a big amount realized it's not working. He spent 3 months taking whatever the hell he was made to take and realize okay this is not doing anything and then he had to really figure out okay who is an andrologist how do I get in front of one where is an andologist in Mumbai where is this clinic came all the way here met this doctor and I'm sure the doctor must have helped him but tells you a little bit right that >> true >> you know he has no paying capacity but

just because of the nature of the problem statement he decided to trust somebody who said okay this is what's going to solve all your life's problems take it and unfortunately it didn't right I have also had very unique experiences from the other side you there's a very um I'll not name him but like very very um celebrated sexologist in India phenomenal phenomenal gentleman and he was you know right before starting I was speaking with him as well he's a very elderly fellow um and really sweet guy and he was telling me Rajat you'll be surprised how many of the

biggest names you can think of have you know come and told me I'll give two lakh res five lakh rupees just help me solve it right so you'll see the nature of what it is right somebody who's very very affluent and really values his privacy is going to maybe the best doctor in India like you know very celebrated gentleman and ready to pay any amount to solve it and then on the other side you're getting somebody who's you know maybe not earning as much to survive in the Mumbai lifestyle right and then still sort of shelving out so much because the problem is affecting

him that deeply right so that see that is where that earlier question of shame also is right because this is what I was I found myself into right this is the uh this was the sort of prior 6 months before starting bulkare where I'm like okay >> I can't be there sitting thinking it just never occurred to us you know like okay this looks like a horrible problem statement and way too many people are facing it and it's not just okay the poor segment is facing or the ultra rich segment is facing it's like across the spectrum across occupation,

lifestyles, whatnot. Folks are facing it and if I keep on going around asking, nobody knows who to go to to solve it, right? They have to they either get scammed or they have to like figure out okay who's that one special doctor in my area who's going to do it. It's not an easy problem statement where right from the comfort of their home, they can do it, right? You know, so so some unique stories were there. Um but yeah, you know, it was quite surprising to see somebody pay that much for something that was, you know, unfortunately a product that I knew from getgo it's not

going to work. Yeah. >> Fantastic. In fact, a couple of very interesting points that came into my head. One, you mentioned that, you know, there's a deep impact in the minds of some of these people when they get scammed. I mean, before they get scammed because of the problem, I realized that there there's a lot of psychological pressure as well. It's not just physical ailment. It's a psychological pressure that puts them into a terrified almost panicky anxietydriven position which makes sure that you know their logical mind doesn't question

>> you know a lot of these drugs magical drugs and so on and so forth but they're like anything that gets me better let's just try it out right if it makes me spend a lot of money >> trust it just because somebody's telling them that okay this is what's going to work for me >> yeah but that also brings me to the second point which is a lot of consumers today are much more exposed much more aware they're gradually doing that. We were having a chat Arjuna and I and he was talking about this thing that you know today consumers uh basis because of

a lot of influencers varied other companies are talking very openly about ingredients that are going into the food that they eating or ingredients that are being applied onto the body it could be paravans it could be gluten-free and what not right and people are now aware so they're much more conscious about it and I think as the com as the country is moving forward in terms of the spending capability ities we would see that the exposure also distills further across tier 1 to two tier three and so on and so forth so that more people are aware about what they're ingesting today

>> right I think that should also potentially help people uh understand that you know don't just believe in non-databacked medication >> look at data and then take a call right so so and plus of course the marketing campaigns that you're doing are going to be phenomenal as well there's so many examples and I'll come to that as Sure. >> But I also noticed that you um you know you have showed you know you've called it out that Brian Johnson is an inspiration >> right? Uh he was in India a few days you

met him. Awesome. >> Yeah. So he's been an inspiration. Do you think >> I saw him met him would be you know uh maybe overselling but yeah was there in that small uh that he did. Yeah. >> Awesome. So Brian talks about his longity longevity focused uh programs right uh or that that or methodologies that they follow or that he follows right do you think that can be applicable to India as well or Indian market at large >> he's at the cutting edge of things you know so

I mean even before I generally feel the way things work in India is something happens in US it takes about 5 years for it to reach Singapore and it takes about like four years more for it to reach India right I'm just sort culturally that's how just things move right so you're always lagging by about 10 odd years our country is huge you know it's a huge population right so um I think in some circles in India it's starting to happen you know in the very very affluent circles in the very educated sort of hyper educated circles where they do have time to focus a lot more on

their personal uh well-being beyond let's say just you know just being healthy to okay how do I you know extend my life right I think there a lot is starting to happen you know uh I think Brian Johnson is phenomen terminal right he's he's absolutely taking things to the edge trying it all himself and telling the world what's working what's not working >> so but I think it's too early for Indian I I think India I think I think a large so I mean see for in for me the once you start building big businesses in India

right and again not to say that we've built something big but we do more than what 110 120 crores a year now >> you interact with so many or you your products are going so far and beyond right you start getting a sense of what Bharat is like you sort of slightly move out of India and get into okay this is what Bharat truly is right and if you see the majority of the populace uh I think there's still some ways from uh sort of that hyper micromanagement of your own health right I think we are solving phase one problem statements that's more like a phase four you know

stage that Brian is on uh I think we have some ways to go there but I think obviously internet is making things easy so it's not going to be the way it was maybe 15 years back that we takes us 15 years to go from 1 to before we'll maybe skip couple and just you know a maybe with genz's and I do see it sometimes they're a lot more conscious you know of what all is happening right and u how is their body behaving to them changing their lifestyle for example >> true >> so to answer your specific questions are is that a trend that's happening in

India you know I think Indians are trying to be healthy I think a lot of great influences are there in the country or making people aware of what's bad in their food what's bad in let's say the uh the things that they're consuming or they're applying. Um I think general education around the problem statements is improving which is where uh we are getting good at basics but yeah in terms of cutting edge maybe we are still some some bits away. I don't think uh the average Indian anytime soon is going to be pondering you know looking at their VO or why is

my HRV dropping below 100 right I doubt we are getting >> you know uh close to that uh like I started wondering why my HRV is dropping I not wearing it only there after just saying u but yeah you know I any I still some some ways away I think you have to see you have to build for India for what it is today with a dream of what you want to make But then you can't be too idealistic. >> This is the ideal sweet spot where I want to find my country in in 5 years and hell be it I'm going to go and do that only because you'll you'll fail. Uh

you have to build for what you what the country is today and then slowly progress towards what you want it to be. Right? So I think still some ways away from maybe a Brian Johnson type uh individual. Uh that being said, some of the entrepreneurs are quite healthy and I think they are really starting to promote healthy lifestyle. Uh so things are changing but yes I think still some ways away. I don't think we are getting that programmatic about our health anytime soon. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Unfortunately but yes.

>> No I mean that's fair right? In fact very interesting point. We we spoke about uh you know people that small pocket of people who are highly knowledgeable uh or education focused highly affluent as well. Uh so my initial thought was that I was linking it back to Maslo's pyramid of hierarchy right and I was saying that roti kapurakan sex self- awareness selfrespect and then eventually you know it comes to a place affluence and then you know self love is where self love is where it comes in >> right where you think about your

longevity having said that a counter thought that comes to my head is about jinzies >> because For them self- loveve is not at the top of the pyramid which is ideally so far it has worked on so many different types of personas of people I think jenzes are defying that trend >> they for them >> self love >> is as basel as roti kapra and macan because they're saying you know it's not at least in the educated tier one cities >> uh they're not >> they want work life balance

>> they want selfcare >> you know mental focus you know mental health focuses and so on and so forth which you know which makes me actually ponder over this fact and you know I'm just putting it out there that for them it self- loveve is not probably post affluency >> whether they're affluent or not they want to make sure the self- loveve is there from the beginning which means that is why they are a lot more >> you know focused on the ingredients that they ingest today that's true >> right they focus on health a lot more if

the if they have limited money they do want to spend that money on ensuring that their lifestyle is much better that what I as a millennial have a millennial has been thinking right >> so interesting I mean >> no I do agree right I think the basics are happening I >> I don't think we are taking it to the extreme yet but at least in a certain segment yes I think awareness around what you are consuming is obviously coming in right I think that was just not a question that people had even 10 years back nobody was looking at the

back of the label and trying to ponder why is there a certain chemical name written and what does it really do right I think that is good that that is where we're moving but yeah uh I think for which is good like we need to solve basics first and then try to solve like very complex problems a very complex one obviously would require more discipline what not like selfd disccipline self self love is obviously very important but it comes with when it comes to healthcare discipline becomes equally important right uh because or else nothing is going to work out

because you have to keep on doing it over time for it to have like real impact on your body so I think >> still some ways away from you know Indians being very I think even you know I think a point to what What you're saying is the conversation around protein in our diet, right? That was just not there and I can just see it so actively now. >> Um I mean Ranir's company Super is doing so phenomenal, right? I think just protein into everything is what now the young Indians are trying to figure out okay am I getting my 2 g per pound or

whatever it is is that happening for me right am I consuming that much so yes we are obviously moving which is very good yeah can't complain >> makes sense uh speaking about reanir reanir Singh's partnership uh >> I would say has added a lot more to the marketing conversations around bold cure >> right through some of the campaigns that he has done but beyond on the marketing campaigns has has the conversation with him led to uh any kind of changes in the product road map or distribution or anything of that sort as well. Has there been other impact as well that you have

seen? uh you know he thinks very big I think uh not really a lot of change in terms of the product road map right because when I met him for the first time I think what he really liked and again I'm speaking for him you know maybe he can come and say Rajat is completely you know Raja I didn't think any of that but from what I could gauge from that early conversation was he really liked >> the way I was trying to build >> and basically you know for me being authentic is very it's very important you know as a person as well as the

brand that we are You wouldn't see us doing a lot of fluff. We are the best, you know, HR company, best PR company. You'll not see us do that. I you will not see me do a lot of that personally as well. I just don't like it. Right. So, I think he liked the fact that we are no nonsense. >> Can we create the best sexual health brand in the country that's legitimately and now obviously wellness as well. We are one of the fastest growing condom brands. We're one of the fastest growing loop brands in the country now. But can we build the best sexual health and

wellness company in India and in a legitimate manner which is not trying to do the same thing that has happened in the ecosystem for the longest time right I think he was also tired of seeing the same sort of even let's talk about marketing he was tired of seeing the same ads in the category he wanted to see something different right he wanted to not approach it again and the same sort of ware guys under a blanket and you know that's the sort of scene uh it's a very runchy sort of a scene that you're showing like can we rethink how we are even taking the problem statement

to the masses right uh and the fact that we want to do it very honestly. I think we want to create products that truly work. The truly work bit is very important for us. I think he really liked that. So the product road map never really uh changed because of that. I think he helped us get more firm on that path. Okay, you know you're you guys are on the right path and this is what we need to just keep on doing. Now >> what he did allow us to do beyond obviously the marketing and other inputs is you know um just think very very big. I think the stage we were at when he

started you know closely working with us we were not as big as what we are today right we were much smaller at that stage and the question that we would keep on hearing from everyone in the ecosystem was can there ever be a 4 cr a month brand in this category can there ever be a 5 cr a month brand in this category can anyone even breach 3 crores you were less than even two at that stage and the answer from everyone was no it's not possible because just nobody had ever done it prior there was no other brand in this space that has done it >> uh like a new age brand right so what he

did was just absolutely be like all right this is going to be the biggest thing you know this can become the biggest brand out there if we stay true to what we are because it's such a large problem statement and there's no avenue for anyone to go to all we need to do is keep our head down keep on executing >> and you know we can get there like we have to just think very very big so that was good you know he obviously you you get a lot of confidence when somebody who's you know that closely involved with the company gives you that >> uh you know uh boost of confidence

behind you so a lot of inputs from him came from those sort sort of perspectives. But then yes, from a pure marketing standpoint, he is >> he's phenomenal. I think his mind really does work quite well. You know, you would be very surprised some of the scripts that he has written for ads that have been successful. I'll not say anything that like he has, you know, at least couple of his ads that did very well, he was the script writer for it, you know. So, uh he has that bent of mine. I think prior to his acting career, he has done a little bit of work

on that side as well. Uh so, yeah, you know, uh a lot of his inputs came on the >> uh marketing branding side. Yes. No, that's fantastic. In fact, uh you know, uh I mean talking about your marketing campaigns, right? You've tackled a lot of uh sensitive topics, if I can take the liberty of saying, >> through the medium of uh humor. >> Yeah. >> So that there's more exposure, more awareness being created. Has any of these campaigns ever backfired or did you see any kind of issues with people, you know, not being able to understand

the exposure that you were trying to create through subtle humor or sometimes not subtle also, sometimes out there humor, >> but it was supposed to create an impact in the right way and sometimes sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't work. Have you seen any of those cases that have backfired as well? >> Um, you know, I'm forgetting. uh like for you know I think comedians are always the first ones to breach hot topics you know that is something I'm forgetting the way you know I was sort of framing

it with one of my somebody one of the investors I was talking to before we were sort of thinking about the campaign uh but the frame of mind that we were having was you know humor is the best way to bring something like this in front of the masses at scale right you don't want to uh just have something which is phenomenal but nobody pays attention to but at the same time have something which is not good but then a lot of people so For us, we knew that okay, humor is the pathway for us to uh you know get in front of as many people as possible and sort of get to them that

okay, we truly want to solve this problem statement and we exist and you can maybe come into the funnel and explore us, right? It's you know very very simple for you to see what Bulkare is doing and how effective it is, right? So we did sort of set that up. Okay, humor is going to be a pathway for us and then it was such a blatant satire that there's just no doubt in it. Right? The fact that we were putting Johnny Sins as the guy who's facing sexual problem statement was basically you know something that people just immediately grapple that okay he's from their let's

say experiences they know that okay he's not going to be the guy who's going to face ED or P as an issue and if I frame him as the guy who's facing first I'm able to tell people that okay anyone can face this problem it's not a certain person that faces it. It's a very common statement, a very common problem and anyone can face it. And second, it just makes people very comfortable because they're like, "Hey, this is the humor." Like they know it's a joke, right? They know what the company's trying to do. They're trying to sort of broach a hard topic by bringing humor in so that

they're aware, okay, we truly solve this, but to get your attention, you know, here's maybe a unique way of doing it. We have never had a campaign that has actually backlashed. You know, it's >> just not happened. You know we've the first campaign that we did I think got about 250 million hits across everything we could sort of track about 250 million hits you know and it was just one Instagram post there was nothing beyond it which was this >> the first one where Johnny was in the K serial sort of a drama >> um so that was just Anir posting it on

his Instagram there was nothing more that we did with it but the amount of then you know sort of parallel content that people started creating around it the amount of PR that started happening which is not paid right um the amount of sort of traction that it generated was about 250 million odd, right? The second campaign which you did you know was maybe a little short of that around 200 but that again you know was quite it just went to I remember one of my investors texting me that Rajat my wife's kitty party uh group that the video got shared and I was like man and

he's like nothing enters into that group you know and somehow this video is entered there I had friends who were in US who are sharing that video back with me uh I'm here telling my friends that this is you know is my brother's company so I you know so tells you right you have to do something you have to have the audacity like you have to be audacious to you know think outside the box when you're challenge creating you're solving for different problem statements there were no PR articles about this category you would find none about it

you know we were not doing uh we not and not that we do now also we do it very selectively but like we were not talking to a lot of media houses you know doing a lot of PR folks coming to our doorsteps asking yeah I want to understand what you guys are doing uh customers realizing okay there's an easy way of solving what not right post Right. It's a category that has really gotten into the limelight. You know, it's gotten its own space in the zeitgeist of the public, right? People know, understand, okay, it's a legitimate problem statement.

>> And there is there are legitimate not just us, there are other guys as well. You know, there are legitimate companies that are trying to solve for it, right? >> So, >> I think something like that had to happen for that inflection point to come where the category goes from something that is very quiet and nobody's paying attention to or something that is very mainstream. Obviously it was not just the campaign it was also the growth of let's the quickcom guys for whom this became a very big category bunch of these things panned out right at the

same sort of let's say 6 month period but I think we had our own small sort of input in doing that right so no to answer your specific question there was never really a backlash that came our way I think at majority people understood what we were trying to do um and it did what we were >> we wanted for it to do right we wanted it for it to travel we wanted for more people to be aware that okay there are companies that are legitimately solving the perception that you have that this is there's everyone is a scam in this category. It's not true.

>> It's also a trust deficit space. You know, for whatever you say, having somebody like Reanir adds a tremendous value just from the fact that he's there. >> True. >> Ranir is not going to just go and pick up any random product and say, "Oh, I'm going to endorse this." Right? He's going to have his thought process behind it. If it's a scam, he's not going to do it. Right? So, the fact that somebody like him is not just doing Arat, but is a co-founder in the company, you know, it tells you a little bit about or tells

the customers a little bit little bit about how what the culture might be, right? And then a lot of trust gets built from Johnny, you know, gracious enough to come down to India to do the shoot. We had to keep him hidden, you know. Uh we literally had to keep give him, you know, the uh I'm forgetting what it's called, the whole the whole get up to make sure that nobody knows he's here. >> The bulker kind of thing, >> the whole like, you know, uh the whole monkey, what do you call it, you know? And

>> uh and it was a phenomenal shoot, you know, Tanma wrote all of it. Uh obviously Ranir was there, Johnny was there. So it was it was a quite a fun time you know doing that. Yeah I'm sure. I mean I do want to get into a little bit more specific on this because uh I saw this ad for the first time on uh LinkedIn. >> Sure. >> Yeah. >> And I am scrolling through LinkedIn which I do on a daily basis. I'm addicted addicted to it. And suddenly I'm like what am I seeing? Right.

because the whole setup was probably one of those Akta Kapoor shows and uh you know and I'm like okay one second I have to see it from the beginning because it already played a little bit and I was like okay no again what am I seeing because did I just see reanir singer then like Johnny and I'm like what's going on and I was mind blown and I was like immedately texting my wife like did you see this because suddenly when I'm scrolling I'm seeing a lot of people talking about this what just happened and that's when I first noticed about bold care

>> unfortunately or fortunately ely it is through that ad that I saw through the commercial that I first saw that and I was like man what are like this is that interesting I need to check out their website I need to see what what exactly are they building and I was very curious >> because I had not seen someone audacious enough to do this >> what was the thought process I know you said it was audacious you had to get the word out >> but what did it take to build that kind of a partnership you said you know it was Ranir it was Johnny it was Tanmai

coming together you know working on this and executing it but how easy was it to kind of create this kind of a partnership and then what was the thought process that went behind >> building it >> it's a lot of I mean see the biggest answer to that is luck you know just things just panned out somehow things just pan out in my life I don't know how it happens but they just some keep on panning out and hopefully they keep on you know going forward as well um but see the way it panned out was >> we we were sure that we wanted to do

something outside the box we were very clear of that you know we didn't want to do something that is just one of many and in about a week everyone has forgotten what it was right you I mean we're talking almost a year after it and I still hear it from folks when I you know sometimes meet them that they still remember that you know it's been a year year plus right so uh we knew that we wanted to be out of the box when we were doing it >> uh we also knew we had no money like >> we had no money you know we were very limited funded brand and again that's a

relative term obviously we had raised a lot of capital Um and subsequently we have raised a lot more as well but at that stage we didn't have as much access to money as somebody would have imagined us to be in the situation we were in. So we like okay you know we're playing a hard game now where this thing better click if it doesn't click you know we are maybe in a dicey spot right. So then taking such a gut well not to sort of you know sort of uh you know blow your own horns but like not to for us to take that call in that moment this is exactly what we're going to do because getting

Johnny from us is an expensive affair. It's not cheap getting you know we were working as a director is a phenomenal phenomenal phenomenal guy but you know it's expensive to work with the best of the best in every from all aspect the best writer the best director obviously the best actor thankfully he didn't charge me because he's already on the company but getting someone like Johnny from the from us and it was not just that right we were shooting we got Ranir with Sema Anand who's one of the foremost sexual sexual earth influencers that was a whole 30-minute chart they

did it was an expensive affair right so we were taking quite a big bet on in that moment but basically it was just pure intuition. I think I and my co-ounders and Ranir I think had really strong intuition that this is going to work. I think we really believed that okay this is exactly what we need to be doing in this moment and if it doesn't work it doesn't work you know what can you do you figure something else out but we just felt okay this is the right thing how it panned out you know we were basically at bay club and what we were doing is basically we called about six

or seven agencies to come and pitch ideas to us right so Ranir me one of my co-founders you're sitting through a lot of these ideas and some of the best agencies and they're phenomenal you know so >> again it's a hard category people can't just think of great stuff so what We by the end of that meeting were like okay this is just like same sounding idea in different words it's the same thing back to back to back and it's as cliche as you could expect. So by the end it was literally I think a 10 12 hour day and both he and me were

sitting right at the end of it and I was telling him which you know I'm not making like none of these make any sense to me right we you and I and Rahul had a blank this is exactly the space we want to be we want it to be gutsy you know we want it to be challenging there are certain things we don't want it to be but we can't be cliche and boring right so now >> who's going to pay attention like you are you're you know you're the brand that's right at the back of the room if you're trying to come right to the front

you can't do what everyone else is doing or else you'll just be there right so at the end of it he said okay I have an idea let me call Tanay up let me get him to think on this so he just calls him up you know and they're good friends so like tan you know think about something about this category >> and then on that journey back from there uh so one of my co-founders basically got that I don't know from where he got it yeah Raj what would it be if we got somehow Johnny to show up in India And that just you know in the moment as soon as I'm like okay this is actually quite

an interesting point he's saying right it will be something that nobody's just absolutely expecting >> uh obviously Buhan bh had gone to us to do something with him and that content piece had done quite well and it was many years back like six seven years back so we knew >> you know a little bit about how maybe it could be perceived um but we like okay this is something very interesting so then I went back to Ranir and Ranir also were like okay very interesting so then the idea of it was something that Ranir and Tanay really came through in terms

what to do just the intuition of okay we need to we can bring somebody like him to India and it could be something that gets people's attention was something that you know one of our co-founders just came like his point of the question we were struggling with was >> how do we frame somebody's who's facing the problem statement like what's the right way to frame this fellow in front of the camera and his point was what if we just get Johnny to be the guy who's facing the problem statement cuz >> that will get the message so clearly to people

which was the main thing we were trying to get across And that was like it logically makes sense. There is that sort of factor to it as well you know which is giving you that. >> So then idea I liked it when I told he loved it when he told bang on idea to let us think now on what we can do with something like this >> and from there I think in 4 months we were doing the shoot. So um yeah you know it is >> it was a unique time period for us as a company as well right the brand was

doing good nowhere close to what we are doing now >> um >> and yeah from from an outside like if I think now it seems like a very gutsy call to take you know from the fact that how much money we had in bank where we were as a brand uh how challenged the category is what all could go wrong possibly you know um but yeah somehow things sort of worked out I mean since then if you sort of look at us I think we would have grown I don't know maybe 300% plus you know uh it's been what

300% plus growth right now we are >> most likely doing around three and a half lakh orders a month >> uh >> yeah three and a half lakhs that's a >> that's a big number that's a big number right specifically in the space which didn't exist four years back three four years back and >> it was non-existent >> I remember conversations with my in with some investors where they were like I I mean I like you as a founder founder and you seem to be having your brain in the right place

>> but I just can't see this ever becoming a 2 cr plus brand you know uh like you know just can't see it like I just don't think it exists my there is not enough avenues for you to go and sell on >> right >> um >> that's fantastic actually you know I know you're being humble about this but uh the growth has been fantastic and it is not just that one particular uh campaign that has worked out right the September campaign or take bold care of her and so on and so forth right there's been so many series of different kind of

campaigns that have worked out so damn well right in fact you spoke about metrics a lot in this conversation and the last bit right I do want to talk to you about this there are so many obvious metrics that people look at in terms of number of orders in terms of revenue and so on and so forth act reutilization of customers and stuff right utilization of products and SKs >> what is that unconventional metric that you think is very critical and important that you think about >> unconventional Hm that's something that you know you look at it maybe it could

be social impact it could be how more people are getting aware or something like that but is there anything else apart from the obvious you know economic metrics that uh you think is very critical because it's a very different uh business in that sense of it >> uh you know again maybe a very cliche answer or like a very uh vanilla answer there but again I you know I mentioned it once prior as well building a company is easy and horribly hard, right? The easy bit is >> you don't have to go and do something that is outside the box to make sense of

everything. It's just that what is presented to you is a horribly hard challenge to solve. >> It's a horribly hard puzzle to solve, right? But the key to understanding what the puzzle is are basics. You know I don't think like for us there are like five things I look at you know from metrics perspective maybe like four or five things I look at and not really much that is going to be quote unquote unique or uh you know something that is going to give me a new lens to how I'm seeing the data right sure as a company matures different things become lot more

important u for example when we were just starting out maybe in the first two odd years of our journey market share or like online market share something nobody I I was at 1% I didn't Um now you know because >> what's the market share now? >> Oh we would be about 22 23% of the online India market share. >> Brilliant. That's the second highest I'm assuming. >> Yeah we would be in some categories we would be the largest company in the space beating some of the biggest legacy

brands and these are phenomenal companies. You know >> everyone who has existed in the space I'm thankful to them for doing the work they have done right. Um but in some categories we are number one but the worst VR is number two. I don't think there's any category where we are number three in India. Uh and either side of us is going to be a legacy brand. A company that has most likely existed for the last two or three decades you know. So we find ourselves in a pretty and you know uh >> lot has worked out for that to be the

situation I find myself into or boldare finds itself into. Um but yeah for example now like market share is something that I look at seriously you know in each and every category what is the share and is it trending up right or uh for the market share to go on am I spending less and less and less rupees in marketing it shouldn't be that I'm just going and guzzling cash and hence my market I'm spending for last 9 months less and less and less money in marketing consecutively and every single month the market share has gone up right maybe like 9 months back it would have

been closer to maybe 15 and now it's closer to let's say 25 maybe 22 23 right most likely 23 um so a quarter of the market you know so and this is only online India so being very specific there um so yeah you know so I don't think there are any extremely unique metrics um but yes there are going to be uh things that you're tracking from different angles I can think of you know unique metrics right right from an investor's perspective and end of the day you are like a CEO your job is to build for the shareholders in one aspect right you you can't completely let that

go as well you have to obviously think about value creation for the folks who are giving you money to you know >> achieve what your targets are what your goals are what your dreams are right so you have to obviously so there you know now where we are mature enough we do think of IRRa like what is a certain investor's you know rate of return over the time that he's invested into the company right and am I doing the right things to you know uh do the best for them as well right or >> profitability as a company is very important to us now you know we're

trending and fairly close to it now uh should be there hope within this year most likely. Um so then you know that becomes a very important you know angle for us to look at okay how are our metrics improving from a profitability standpoint right am I is my rorowass expansion happening you know where for the same amount of money that I'm spending or maybe lesser am I getting a better return on ad spends right so I don't think there are any unique metrics that we look at I think they're going to be bits and pieces here and there but largely it's a simple game you know

there are simple sets of things you have to look at they will give you insights it's all about what you do with those insights and how you you go and execute. Yeah. >> Fantastic. uh PR you have actually emphasized on the fact on a few uh uh times you know in the conversation right now about the leadership capabilities you know of solving those hard problems you know what according to you is probably that key trait in a leader that you value the most >> I think

I think there are few of them >> but Now looking back and again you know I think I'm too young to really give you the right answer to that. I think in five or 10 years once I'm able to really think about the whole journey of the last 10 years for me. I think then I'll really start getting you know the I'm too in it to think outside uh from the outside in. But from where I am right now you know I would say >> like you have to just be an optimist like I remember I was telling you you know behind the scenes I was telling you a couple of stories about how things

have been. uh uh maybe I'll just sorry excuse me but there was a certain situation when you know there was not enough money in our bank right um and we were going executing really hard problems at that at that time and those outcomes had to be generated or else we were you know pretty messed up as a company we would have been in a very very hard spot right >> and sure I was very stressed out and you know as you should be or else you know you're you're not bought into it at that point if you're not stressed out I was horribly stressed out but I do remember

very active ly thinking somehow my brain is just an optimist you know like even in this situation it's just like yeah you know most likely this is going to pan out like this looks like it's going to pan out you know and there were like 10 challenges and there's like one good thing and somehow my mind is just going and gravitating towards that okay this thing is there which is going to make sense of all of these things like in 6 months from now 12 months from now right so I think I've just been an absolute optimist for a very long time it's sometimes crazy when I think about it

like when I have that chat in my own optimist because whenever a problem hits me I think my first response is like [ __ ] you know I'm dead and then immediately the next response like ah you know >> there is a solution here well I can figure it out you know I I know where that answer lies it's going to be obviously hard but like we'll get there so I think for a for a leader >> you have to be optimistic because >> you know and from leader you know obviously there are different types of leaders right and different leaders have

different roles in an organization so I'm obviously going to like I'm talking about my experience and let's say that's as a CEO right and I can see in my team there are so many great leaders and they have different challenges to solve for right in some cases maybe it's more just pure team management skill sets right in certain sort of uh sort of leaders in my organization it's just a team management absolute efficiency in doing that right but at least at my stage what I realized is the buck stops at me you know there's nobody above me who's going to come and tell me

you know like you will figure all of these things out so for me it had to be I myself have to keep on telling myself yeah you know most likely you'll figure it out and for the first few years when it was like extremely hard >> that helps you a lot so I think a lot of it is just pure optimist being a pure optimist you know >> um >> and that doesn't mean you can be dumb you know that you you that doesn't give you the le to just go and do stupid things >> right

>> uh but I think first would be optimist second would be like pure grit to follow through on that optimism because optimism you still taking that step is like Okay, you know, you have to be slightly out of your mind to take that fifth step. Um, >> I think I would be that. And third, I feel is logical. You know, I think a lot of folks are not logical. You know, they're not >> like a logical pragmatic mix. You have to be logical in every situation you find yourself into, right? And just sort of think what is it that

you need to do in this place, right? Like what there's no book which is going to teach you. I'm as uneducated as I'm a 12 plus guy like I have no education, right? So it's not that some great yarn was given to me. So I like okay you know I have to just be logical pragmatic in the situation and sort of figure out okay what do I need to do you know what do I need to say what do I need to what are the problems I need to solve first which allows me to solve the bigger set of problems so I think yeah it's a mix of like optimism which allows you to like

just even dream a little bit grit to sort of go along those uh like go on the line there and then maybe a little bit of logic and pragmatism yeah sort of put it all together uh there are a lot more things that obviously go into it but if I had to like you know in the moment sort of think I think as I said the three things right so uh it's about how optimistic you are you know that sort of allows you to uh you know dream big I think second would be grit because that allows you to sort of execute on the dreams you have and sort of get you to you know keep on solving all the

challenges that come in front of you the third would be being logical you know uh pragmatic as a as a human being which make sure that you're getting the right you're actioning on the right thoughts right you're actioning on the right points that are coming in your mind. Um I would say these three um and I would say luck you know just pray that you're lucky you know and >> somehow things fall into your lap at the right time and you're like oh this happened now let me just you know take this and run. So >> amazing that's that's amazing. Thank you

so much uh you know that those were really good uh insightful perspectives. I think the people who are listening to you, watching you would go back really uh filled with a lot of insights, right? >> I hope so. Well, >> yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure. And but I do want to make sure that you know we talk to you about some fun stuff as well. >> Okay. >> Uh so we have a very interesting round called as rapid fire. Very very original to us. So So we're going to get into that and we do have a hamper at the end of it. There's a hamper right here. It's

personalized to you. >> So we're going to give it to you after the end of the rapid fire, right? So either which ways respective how you perform is not comfortable with car so you're going to get it. >> Okay that's good stakes are slightly low. Yeah, but I think uh you know people are going to judge you, right? That's how the society is today. So more quick quirky witty your answers are. Let's see. Yeah. Awesome. So, okay. So, let's get get into this, right? Which book is currently open on your Kindle? >> Uh I'm not reading anything right now.

I'm not a big reader. Um what I'm doing I mean I was I used to read quite a lot but not actively. >> Um yeah, I I think I'm listening to a lot of history podcast. I'm listening to a World War I series right now. I think that's the thing I'm doing in my free time. I I'm enjoying it quite a lot. Yeah. >> Amazing. If Bulkier had a mascot, what animal would it be and why? >> Bulk had a mascot, what animal would it be? Uh, I think Honeybatcher, you know, from what I've seen, again, I've never seen

one in real life, but the fact that somehow [ __ ] we find ourselves where we find, you know, ourselves is it's I the odds were very low for it to happen when we started. So I think the fact that we just kept on coming back and competing with like the very big guys and out competing them I think that you know maybe >> very interesting. What's the most unusual place that you ever brainstormed a business idea? >> Ever brainstormed a business idea. Well, obviously there were a lot of other things that were going on, but

what ended up happening was the three >> uh you know the we were basically standing there and having chai and I was telling my this was I think at >> it's quite late into the night uh so not excited but it's open for very long you know it's open till very late in the night >> um illegally and yeah that's where the idea came because I was telling my guy yeah dude we need to do this you know this is something that I feel is what's I've gathered a a lot of experience and this is then when the six month period for us started and we started going to

all of these doctors. Uh but yeah, you know, I think that was >> where the main idea came from. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay. Fantastic. If you could launch a bulkier product for any other species, which animal would you choose? >> Hard problem, you know. Uh which animal would I choose? [Music] You know what's an animal that is really struggling from a population perspective? Oh, maybe for a tiger. I hope there are more tigers. You know, I hope I allow them, you know, uh I they

have more intercourse and there's, you know, more tigers around in the world. I hope that answers the question. >> Maybe the vigers are the need. >> Some unique solution for them to maybe have more more. Yeah. >> Awesome. If you could have dinner with any three people, dead or alive, who would they be? Horribly hard question. Uh who would they be? >> H dead or alive, right? >> Yeah. >> So, one would be Mahatma Gandhi. I would be keen to meet who he was. I want to I

would love to understand what the person is, you know, or who the person was. Um >> I think Marcus Aurelius would be interesting. >> Um I think Augustus would be interesting. I would really want to maybe go even further back. I think that would be an interesting fellow to actually see. Okay. You know, He did some unique stuff. So that would be an interesting fellow to actually see. >> Who else? >> Um I think Ashoka would also be quite

interesting you know. So from so you you you get the nature of the answer. The answer is not for me to get talk anything. I just want to see who they are you know and how they looked what they said and they did pretty phenomenal things. So how did they even do it right? Yeah, I mean all the way back from the Roman Empire to Ashoka dynasty and then >> so I went to both sides you know one is like a the most recent one that I would want to meet and then two would be where I find them to be very unique personalities which

>> accomplished a lot for what they found themselves into. >> Makes sense. What's your guilty pleasure TV show or movie? I have started seeing animes a lot now you know somehow it's like a curve in my life where I used to watch it then I never watched it then I was like okay you know and then some random ones which nobody would expect someone like me to be watching I'm like okay you know let's just go and see it >> okay >> uh there's some it's one is called this one I recently saw people going to laugh

when they hear it uh it's called something kagu or something you know love is what it's like a high school funny you know like shut your brain train off and watch it for like 30 minutes. Okay, not bad. You know, this is fun. >> That's why it's a guilty pleasure. >> Yes. >> Uh what's the weirdest DM that you've received after starting BA? >> Uh weirdest I've not had lot of DMs, you know. I'm not a very socially active person. You wouldn't find any social

presence for me. >> Uh so I guess that limits the >> It could be friends as well. It could be friends, it could be anyone else. Oh, from that perspective, I have had somebody who told me um four years after starting it that he um you know, so very very close friend of mine that I used to speak to so damn regularly that for four years he never told me that he used to use my products and then one day like I want to tell you you know I really like what you guys are doing. It helps me a lot. I'm like okay I'm very thankful and I'm very thankful you're telling me uh

you should have told me before I would have felt more confident. I would have built even faster but thankfully you're telling me now which is good you know and yeah I've had that once once or twice it has happened uh it once or twice it has also happened that I'm speaking to somebody uh so once it happened where uh my younger brother so I have a cousin brother he's a very very sweet guy uh and somehow being young I think for him he sees me slightly differently right he sees me like slightly bigger than what I am so he was telling his friend K my brother is you

know founder of this company blah blah blah and then the guy he was telling it to had a bold careare condom in his back, right? That he takes it out. So then they made a whole video and send that is very cool, you know, because he's randomly telling it to some friend that he's just meeting. They were about to go to college together. So they're meeting to they're moving to Germany. So like, okay, that is pretty unique. You know, randomly he's met a guy and he has it right in his bag. So yeah. >> Wow. Nice. Uh if you had to pitch Bit in a Bollywood movie style,

>> which actor would play you? Uh do I have to say Rani Singh now? I don't know. >> Up to you. >> Which actor would play me, you know? Uh I don't know. Ranir Singh is too good-looking, you know. So that wouldn't fit the bill. Um now anyone else I say he's going to be somebody who say is not good-looking, you know. Uh >> what do you say? Reanbir Kapoor. I don't know. Uh, no, but I think with, you know, enough on his face, I think Rir can look

slightly worse than what he is today. And then, you know, I think that will get him to play me, I guess. I don't know. Not thought too much. I'm just going to say his name. Yeah. >> Uh, which BK product would you recommend for someone who's going on their first date? >> Uh, protection is important, right? So, Bulk condom, I think we have um something called ultra thin delay. It's one of the it's one of the most successful condoms that you are going to find in the online India space right now. Some of the biggest platforms is a

top seller. >> Um it's a very well thought out, very well done product. So I'm sure people will like the experience. Yeah. >> Uh what's the funniest myth about men's wellness that you've heard from customers? >> Um you know I've had maybe I think the funniest you know unfortunately a lot of these conversations are not funny. you know that that's the bit here where it is sometimes you know unfortunate >> myth might be funny

>> yeah the myth you know I mean it's all sorts of products that people have tried it's you'd be very surprised what >> folks have tried with the hopes that it truly works right and I guess that would be it I can't think of anything right off the top of my mind but um it would be some random thing that somebody has tried which somebody has told me okay this is >> uh yeah I mean some from a myth perspective what I also find funny is like you know um Like I think you know I think the one which I do feel maybe it's not not funny but

maybe just to mention I think there was a which is slightly changing but there was a narrative and at least I was growing up that porn is fine and you know all of that I think that is a myth I don't think porn is fine you know I don't think it I think it messes up men's mind quite a lot you know it's >> shouldn't be as normalized as it was at least in certain spheres where at least I was growing up I don't know what's happening Right now I think there's the nout November and bunch of you know I think the the the pendulum has swung there which is good but at least a point

I don't know if you remember that but like at least like 2015 2016 a lot of positivity around it it's like inclusive >> Johnny's listening to us >> potentially sorry >> Johnny is going to be listening to this potentially >> no I think he understands I think see everything has to be done in moderation right you can't be the problem is that there's no moderation sometimes in certain for certain but like yeah >> so speaking of Johnny if Johnny were to give you advice on business what do you think would it be

>> uh uh uh never stop keep doing what you're doing in the sense because you know he's just been doing >> he's been successful in his profession for like three decades now which is for the profession that he is in >> very long >> quite a phenomenal you know run that he's on right now it was three decades 30 years two and a half decades I think two and a half years so it's like you know tells you a little bit about who he is and I think that is what he would tell me you know

>> keep performing at your best for as as long as you can. >> Makes sense. Pun intended. >> Uh, which last one? Which awkward question do you wish more people would just ask boldly? >> Uh, which can you repeat the question once? >> Which question do you do you think most people should ask boldly? I mean, they're normally any question that most people are very apprehensive about, but do you think that they should just go out there and ask that question boldly? H

can't think of anything you know what should people ask boldly >> I mean on sexual uh health and wellness >> uh I mean a very boring answer but like I think you know an answer to that would be I think people should venture out to find a solution to the problem right if they're facing it they should not be there sitting in their like you know sitting with themselves sort of thinking that okay there's no way I'm going to ever solve it it's a very easy solution to a problem I think they should just boldly be there saying okay you know I

need to actively figure out what I have to do to solve it and then take the right actions. Yeah, take the right steps. >> Yeah, makes sense. I mean, in my head, I was just thinking out loud when you were saying this. I was like, I think one of the first things that we can probably see is a guy or a girl, anyone going into a pharmacist and saying, "Can you give me a condom?" >> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. >> Boldly, right? There's no harm in asking this question. People have had so much tabute about you know looking that when

the pharmacist is alone there not enough people looking at you and then you're like >> I do agree yeah >> yeah but awesome thank you so much and I do think that in this case you genuinely deserve the handle thank you so much >> thank you so much this is by Capek design you metal earlier today >> yes I did >> and uh this is Capic Design is into highly personalized stationary and corporate gifting Okay, >> so this is personalized to you. Thank you so much

>> for joining in, taking your time and sharing some amazing perspectives with us. And I think with this conversation, I'm hoping that more people >> understand why sexual wellness conversations are super important and critical. And hopefully they come out more boldly and start using Boldare products. >> Yeah, hopefully. Yeah. Well, thank you so much. I love loved being here. I was telling you before that I rarely do podcasts if not if ever. >> Um, but I really liked it. I really enjoyed it. So yeah, thank you.

>> Thank you. Thank you so much. Lovely seeing you. >> All right. [Music] [Music] Feel free to share your perspectives through comments. Subscribe to the channel and do send us some suggestions as well.